PO Boss

The More Things Change...

2006-02-09T09:28:00.000-05:00

...The More They Stay the Same

Speaker Quinn offered us little hope yesterday, spewing the same old term limits garbage. In an interview with the Daily News Editorial Board, here's Queens Q in her own words...

Where do you stand on term limits?

I am opposed to term limits and I am open to the idea of taking the time from eight to 12 years. I am open to doing that legislatively and I am open to do that through a referendum. Doing it is not something that is on our legislative agenda anytime soon.

Would you be speaker without term limits?

Probably not.

The voters have twice set eight-year term limits. Why is 12 better?

Twelve years give folks more time to have an institutional memory, become experts in an issue. Part of the negative results of term limits is that you end up with staff and lobbyists carrying the institutional memory in a way that isn't healthy. One of the unintended consequences is the expanding presence and role of lobbyists in City Hall.

How is it possible after, say, five years, that a Council member isn't up to speed?

The idea that you would know everything there is to know in your first term or five years doesn't really appreciate how diverse this job is if you want to do it well. A big chunk of your first term is spent focused on the district and the district's needs, which is a good thing. But at some point you want to be able to take that district experience and turn it into legislative accomplishment.

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We're Back!

2006-01-22T17:54:00.000-05:00

No Likey What We See

We took a bit of a break over the past week. Speaker Quinn was settling in ... and at least started giving the appearance that she was backing away from the term limits battle.

But we knew it was too good to be true.

In yesterday's Daily News, Edward Wallace (Chief of Staff to one time Councilwoman Carol Bellamy) squared off against Ron Lauder on the issue of term limits. Obviously, Wallace was pro, Lauder con.

Seems innocuous enough, right?

Think again! Turns out Wallace was a contributor to Speaker Quinn. Somebody is doing somebody else's bidding. NICE!

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Shout Out to the Newbies

2006-01-11T19:33:00.000-05:00

Lappin, White & Vacca

We commend newly installed Council Members Jessica Lappin, Thomas White and James Vacca for going on the record as siding with the voters on the term limits issue - meaning, they have absolutely no plans to undo their own term limits legislatively.

We also commend newly installed Council Member Rosie Mendez for being honest about her position, that she will have no hesitation overturning the will of the voters legislatively. Obviously, we do not share her point of view.

That all happened on tonight's airing of NY1's Inside City Hall.

And Council Member White ... he delivered the most poignant line of the evening:

You can't represent the people, and also say that I'm going to go against the people.

Term Limits Chart Updated: The neys still have it, 18-12, as of 1:30PM, January 12, 2006.

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Quinn - Not Gonna Do It

2006-01-10T19:46:00.000-05:00

At Least Not for Right Now

Looks like Speaker Quinn is hitting the brakes big time on the term limits ride.

On her debut interview as Speaker tonight on NY1's Inside City Hall, Speaker Quinn backed away from the term limits battle telling host Dominic Carter, "It [term limits] is not on our immediate legislative agenda," and then she went in to a whole hullabaloo about talking internally, externally, with New Yorkers, etc.

Something tells us that at some point in the not so distant future, Quinn's feet will come off the brakes and the pedal ... it's gonna hit the metal. So hang on!

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Step Away from the Term Limits

2006-01-09T19:50:00.000-05:00

3 Out of 4 Consultants Agree

Democratic consultant Jen Bluestein signaled her agreement with rival Republican consultants Mike McCuen and Susan del Percio (on tonight's Consultants' Corner segment on NY1's Inside City Hall) that Speaker Christine Quinn should go nowhere near the pending term limits battle.

del Percio had this to say:

I think she [Speaker Quinn] should really tell New Yorkers that she respects them by not moving forward with this proposal on term limits. She should tell them ... you know what voters, I have faith in you.

And McCuen had this harsh warning:

If she takes on term limits she's going to suffer a crushing defeat ... fighting that fight is a loser.

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Do Our Eyes Deceive Us?

2006-01-09T01:06:00.000-05:00

Quinn Backing Down

Could it be? Is it possible that la Speaker Quinn is already starting to peddle her way backwards on promises made to her colleagues to alter term limits legislatively?

This weekend, the Daily News published Frank Lombardi's interview with the new Speaker. And in response to the question of whether she could have achieved the Speakership without term limits, Quinn concluded this way...

We need to grapple with the issue of term limits and figure out whether and where it fits in our legislative agenda.

Now that's what we're talking about ... we likey ... we likey very much!

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The Vox

2006-01-07T11:02:00.000-05:00

The People Be Damned

In today's Daily News, Mary Ann Carey, a Howard Beach resident lets loose on Council Speaker Christine Quinn and her colleagues for wanting to tinker with term limits.

Here's a snippet:

This is a breach of everything we hold sacred in our democratic society. No matter what your political persuasion, this attempt to circumvent the voters reeks of impropriety.

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You Are Not the Boss of Me!

2006-01-06T16:36:00.000-05:00

Council Chutzpah

So ... you put us in office? Big fuckin' deal!

I now run the East Wing of City Hall. That's a big deal, my friend!

It means you answer to me, and that what I say goes. Oh yeah, and what he says, it goes as well ... no ifs, ands or buts.

I don't give a dammmmmn if you voted for term limits, sucka!

Oh! You did it twice? Well doesn't that just make you twice the fool..?..?...

Anyway, we already have term limits ... they're called elections! Ever heard of 'em?

Don't give me the story that you couldn't make it to the polls that Tuesday because you had to drop-off your kids at school and run to work - you lazy bum you!

Uh huh! You work two jobs to make ends meet? Doin' what ... exactly?

And what was that? The poll workers at your polling site gave you the run-a-round? They told you that the polling site you've been going to for 15 years suddenly moved 2 avenues and 3 blocks over?

And when the machine broke down, they didn't let you fill out an affidavit ballot?

Not possible!! Those are my bestest trained peeps!

And who gives a crack if the candidate you petitioned for was no longer on the ballot? I'm sure the folks at the Board of Elections have a good explanation for the disappearance.

And what about your grandmother? She couldn't squeeze her wheelchair into the polling site?

What is wrong with you my cranky, lazy voter?

Because there is no doubt in my mind that we here at the Council have done our job and done it well ... and should be allowed to stay here forever and ever and ever.

NO MATTER WHAT THE PO BOSS MAY SAY!

(a satire of what it often feels like to be a NYC voter)

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Denny Farrell

2006-01-05T19:36:00.000-05:00

Drops the Freakin' Ball!

On NY1's Inside City Hall tonight, State Party Chairman Herman Denny Farrell joined Speaker Quinn in the "you're not the boss of me" club! Voters be dammmmmned!

When asked point blank by Dominic Carter whether he felt that the Council should change term limits legislatively, Farrell balked and fell back on the ol' party line ... that we have natural term limits called elections.

That may or may not be a valid argument - and certainly one worth debating - but Mr. Farrell, what gives you or any other elected official the right to undo the will of the voters?

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Speaker Quinn's Move

2006-01-05T12:48:00.000-05:00

Check or Check Mate?

A battle royal on the term limits front is up next ... without a doubt.

How will the newly minted Speaker Quinn handle this first major hurdle? Will she push ahead to change term limits legislatively, in spite of two voter referendums, or will the Mayor throw her a bone, and give her and back another referendum?

Honestly, we haven't a clue, but are anxious to find out.

In the mean time, we thought we'd refer you to a recently published poll in the New York Sun by New Yorkers for Term Limits (Lauder's group) in which 77% of New Yorkers polled were in favor of placing eight year term limits on the State Legislature and the Governor. No big surprise ... since Albany was recently voted the worst State government in the entire US.

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WARNING! WARNING!

2006-01-04T11:59:00.000-05:00

Step Away from the Term Limits!

Such were the warnings given to newly minted Council Speaker Christine Quinn by the edit heads at the Daily News and NY Post, as well as by Daily News columnist Michael Goodwin.

Here's a snippet from Goodwin's piece:

By going the legislative route, instead of putting the measure before voters, Quinn will prove herself an inferior public servant to her two predecessors. Both Peter Vallone and .Gifford Miller opposed term limits, but felt obligated to listen to the public, and so rejected self-dealing legislation. Quinn thus begins by sticking her finger in the public's eye. Nice.

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Dirty Rotten Scoundrels?

2006-01-03T10:09:00.000-05:00

Haberman Asks

Clyde Haberman, New York Times columnist, goes straight for the Council's jugular today. Playing off of John Lithgow's references during Mayor Bloomberg's inauguration on Sunday, Haberman says this of the Council's pending term limits antics:

With "scoundrels" hanging in the air, the mind turned to questions about whom the public might deem possible candidates for that label.

How about some members of the City Council? Quite a few have talked about voting themselves an extra term beyond the two terms to which the City Charter now limits them. Never mind that New Yorkers voted not once but twice to impose a limit of two terms. Some in the Council now believe that they have a right to change the voter-determined rules by legislative fiat. Hmm. Could there be a handy word for such people? Many in New York might wonder.

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As the News Turns...

2006-01-02T16:57:00.000-05:00

Speaker Christine Quinn

Ok. Now that the next Speaker appears to be a fait accompli, it's time to get down to the people's business.

Here's a look back at where the soon-to-be-minted Speaker, Christine Quinn, stands on the issue of term limits:

In an interview with WNYC's Bob Hennelly

In her Citizens Union candidate questionnaire

As far as we can tell, Speaker Quinn will go full force into changing term limits legislatively.

Can we get a holla?

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Speaker Vallone's 2006 Predictions

2006-01-01T23:07:00.000-05:00

"Let's Kick Around the City Council"

In a rather interesting and revealing interview in the Gotham Gazette, former Council Speaker Peter Vallone weighs in today on all sorts of issues - ranging from campaign finance to life under Bloomberg to the state of the Democratic Party.

But what is perhaps most interesting, aside from Vallone's strong support of the Council altering its own term limitations legislatively, is his prediction that 2006 will be all about the term limits saga. Here's a snippet of what he says:

Well, unfortunately, I think term limits is going to be a big story. If the council passes, and I hope they do, a measure to extend the limit to 12 years, for sure there's going to be a referendum put on the ballot to reverse it. And there will be a lot of very bad publicity for the council members, which will result in their being afraid to do anything. And they may not even be able to pass the term limits bill for fear of reprisal.

It's just going to be a continual knock on the city council, which really doesn't deserve it. I think that they deserve a lot of credit for changing the policy of the city and making it a better place to live. And unfortunately, there doesn't seem to be any way of communicating with the electorate the truth of what's going on. And the big story in 2006 is probably going to be "Let's kick around the city council."

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A Tongue Lashing in NY Civics

2005-12-30T13:19:00.000-05:00

A la Henry Stern

Earlier this year, former Parks Commissioner Henry Stern, gave a well-deserved scolding to those Council Members who seem to have an overblown sense of their own importance and power.

Here's a snippet of this very worthwhile read from the New York Civic:

Why should anyone want to leave the Council, with its six figure salary, including lulus, the lack of any restriction on outside work or income, the ample staffs, the mailing privileges at public expense for self-serving illustrated brochures, and all the privileges and emoluments which come with good pay and light work, which basically consists of intoning 'Aye' upon hearing your surname mentioned on a roll call? ...

... But the Council insiders are utterly without shame, or regard for the decisions of the electorate. They can be expected, on the basis of past performance, to do everything they can to preserve their privileged positions of pomp and power.

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The Refs is History

2005-12-29T11:13:00.000-05:00

Part Deux

Most recently, we highlighted the language used in the last two term limits ballot measures.

Now we turn to the results:

1993 (Measure enacting term limits)

Voting Yes: 610,000 (59%)
Voting No: 420,000
Abstained: 860,000

1996 (Measure to extend term limits to 12 years)

Voting Yes: 560,000
Voting No: 650,000 (54%)
Abstained: 690,000

Note: During both elections, approximately 1.9 million people turned out to vote.

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Here's Where They Stand

2005-12-28T10:04:00.000-05:00

Updated

It's been a while since we last updated our term limits chart. Here's our latest rendition of where each of your lovely Council Members (and Council Members-elect) stand on the issue of overturning the will of the people.

As far as we can tell, the neys still lead 17-11.

But, if you have any other information that can help us fill in the blanks ... we'll take it!

Simply email publicsway@yahoo.com with your insights.

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Update to the Update: Make that 18-11 as of 12:00am, Thursday, December 29th.

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The Refs is History

2005-12-27T13:49:00.000-05:00

A Look Back

As the Speaker's race comes down to the wire, we thought now would be a good time to take a quick look back at the past two referendums that brought term limits into existence - paying particular attention to the differences in the wording of the two ballot measures.

The first effort driven in 1993 by cosmetics magnate, Ron Lauder, was worded as follows:

Should the New York City Charter be amended by the addition of a new Chapter 50 to provide that a person may not hold the office of mayor, public advocate, comptroller, borough president or City Council member for more than two consecutive terms?

The second, driven by the City Council in 1996, was worded as follows:

The proposed local law would amend current Charter provisions which prohibit the Mayor, Comptroller, Public Advocate, borough presidents and members of the City Council from serving more than two full consecutive terms, including at least one four-year term for Council members, after January 1, 1994. The proposed local law would prohibit those officials from serving more than three full consecutive terms or twelve consecutive years, whichever is greater, after January 1, 1994, except for members of the City Council first elected in the year 2003, who would be prohibited from serving more than ten consecutive years. Shall the proposed local law be approved?

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Remember Fiala?

2005-12-26T14:49:00.000-05:00

The Councilman Who Saved Term Limits

The date was March 15, 2001. The then 33-year old Republican Council Member from Staten Island's 51st district, Stephen Fiala, cast the deciding vote keeping term limits in place. But before doing so, Fiala gave a long impassioned speech about his vote.

Needless to say, our favorite line was the following:

As wrong as term limits are - and they are - the means prescribed in redressing this wrong are potentially worse.

Read the speech in its entirety here!

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Warm Fuzzy Feelings

2005-12-23T12:41:00.000-05:00

As History Repeats Itself

Who the hell knows? But a reading through the legislation to repeal term limits in 2001 made us feel a bit funny inside ... perhaps because it could have been written today.

Anyway, enough about our feelings ... here's our favorite line from the legislation, a read we entirely suggest:

The Council therefore finds that the term limits provision adopted by public referendum constitute an inappropriate imposition by the majority of voters on the individual liberties and voting rights of all voters and that this undue power of the majority is contrary to well-established standards of democracy.

There you have it boys and girls!

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The Vox

2005-12-22T16:36:00.000-05:00

NYC Dems: Screw the People

Republican Scott Sala of Slant Point and Urban Elephants launched this rant over the past summer about the Council's proposed antics:

I oppose term limits, but I oppose any partisan effort to overturn the people's will. Indeed, true term limits is effectively an election. So I say vote these Democrats out of office before they screw the people of New York further.

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Muzzio's Sharp Blade

2005-12-21T22:13:00.000-05:00

On the Record

In a broad piece on term limits, James Withers of the New York Blade recaps the recent forum on term limits, and gets this somewhat balanced view of the issue from CUNY Prof Doug Muzzio:

Muzzio thinks there's a simple reason why the City Council wants to tinker with limits: self interest. "They are there and don't want to leave," Muzzio said. "Or they want to leave on their own terms."

However, Muzzio also offered some healthy critique of voters, noting that their asking for politicians to serve a set amount of years is an easy out.

"Elections are term limits. Artificial term limits are a labor saving device for a lazy electorate," Muzzio said.

A lazy electorate? Professor Muzio, pleeeeaaase! What up with bitch-slapping the voters?

Simply calling us lazy seems to us ... well ... also a bit lazy, and does a disservice to some of the real systemic issues of the day - ballot bumping, shoddy redistricting, self-serving elected officials (as you point out), a completely screwed up Board of Elections, poorly trained election workers ... and we could go on and on and on.

Don't you think that perhaps these issues might give some voters pause before heading to the polls?

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We'd Like an Apology

2005-12-20T11:10:00.000-05:00

So Says the Southeast Queens Press

In an editorial entitled "Killing the Term Limits Coup," the edit head at the Southeast Queens Press (a publication of the Queens Tribune) doesn't hesitate to call out the Council's latest term limits antics as self-serving, and demands that the seven Speaker candidates apologize for their bad behavior. Here's a snippet:

It is clear to this writer that the voters, if given the opportunity, would never stand for the Council’s self-serving outrage and the Mayor has pledged to give the voters the last word.

Certainly those self-serving members recognize the people would never tolerate their unilateral action. The Mayor’s statement may be enough for them to abandon their attempted power grab.

We call upon the seven Speaker candidates to publicly change their position and apologize to the people of this city.

We ask the Mayor to consider a proposal that would prevent this or any future Council from legislatively disregarding the voted will of the people.

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The Daily News and the Jugular

2005-12-19T08:53:00.000-05:00

It's Where the Edit Heads are Aiming

In a blistering editorial today, the Daily News cautions Council Members giving the slightest bit of thought to altering their own term limits, that they should be fully prepared to face an all-out assault.

The piece encourages Bloomberg not only to put the term limits issue to another voter referendum, but to give it some company as well:

... the commission could put additional issues to a vote such as requiring all future changes to term limits be done by referendum, or barring Council members from awarding themselves fat stipends for chairing committees, or requiring Council pay raises to be voted upon in advance of primary elections and to take effect only with the seating of a new session, or restoring the limits on union donations, or cutting off public campaign funds from pols who have no serious opposition, or protecting the campaign finance laws from Council meddling.

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The Case vs. Term Limits

2005-12-18T11:04:00.000-05:00

The Wise Guys' Wisdom

This week's New York Observer Wise Guys take aim at Mayor B's supposedly feigned outrage over the Council's term limits maneuvering.

In a piece that attempts to justify the Council's latest tactics, Hofstra Professor Eric Lane (and Special Counsel to outgoing Speaker Gifford Miller) offers these observations:

... "unless you accept that there is something intrinsically good about new people, I don't see the value in [term limits]. There are always going to be bad eggs in the world. But they are just as likely to be bad eggs when they are newly elected."

The popularity of term limits, Mr. Lane added, is fueled by a "utopian American reform mind-set that instinctively dislikes people who hold power, without any thought as to the consequences of that idea."

We say - very interesting, Professor - but with all do respect, we could not disagree more with how you've characterized our mind-set of reform.

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A Batty Change of Heart

2005-12-16T11:51:00.000-05:00

On the Record

Howard Mortman of the The National Journal, had this to say of term limits back in 2001:

I used to think term limits were a silly, lazy way to effect change. But now, because of New York City, I've changed sides.

Why? Because, quite frankly, term limits make the establishment go nuts. Absolutely batty. Term limits make the arrogant forget they're arrogant.

Click here to read the piece in its entirety.

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Notable Quotable

2005-12-15T09:52:00.000-05:00

New York Sun, June 20, 2005

Term limits may also create perverse political incentives, in which council members, with limited time in office, are preoccupied with making headlines through overly bold initiatives to increase visibility in their districts and around the city.

"There is definitely a sense in the media that some of the actions taken in this body lack gravitas," one council staff member said. "Sometimes it is driven because people feel like they're scrambling." This aide said some council members are very conscious that they have only a short "window" in which to get things accomplished.

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The Energizer Bunny

2005-12-14T16:59:00.000-05:00

Avella Keeps Going and Going...

Washington Square News, the official newspaper of NYU, recently covered the Council's plans to extend their term limits.

In the piece by Kaveri Marathe, maverick Queens Councilman Tony Avella concludes this way:

“This shouldn’t be done, period,” Avella said. “But the only honorable way is by referendum.”

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Get Your Hands Off My Term Limits!

2005-12-14T13:06:00.000-05:00

Independence Party Gets into the Act

The next Council Speaker will undoubtedly have their hands full!

On Monday, we reported on the newly formed People to Stop a Self Serving Council.

And now, we are told that the next Speaker should add this latest project of The New York City Independence Party to their list of concerns, www.handsofftermlimits.org.

Though as we reported on Backroomie, the petition could use a bit of help!

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Bring in Da Noise...

2005-12-14T10:02:00.000-05:00

Bring in Miller's Funk

Winnie Hu reports in today's New York Times about the on-again, off-again, on-again noise code negotiations. She cites the legislation as the last major item remaining on Mayor B's legislative agenda from his first term.

And then takes a nose dive into Speaker Miller's noise code political posturing. Some now believe that, due in part to term limits, Miller is seeking one last hoorah before his quickly nearing departure from the Council. Though when he was running for Mayor, Gifford had not intention of letting this bill see the light of day.

Robert Bookman, lawyer for the New York Nightlife Association appeared not too sympathetic of Miller's plight:

"We're now on the right track," he said. "The process is starting to work. It should not be cut short. There's no midnight deadline here. No one's going to turn into a pumpkin."

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The Vox

2005-12-13T16:40:00.000-05:00

Crash Landing

Another day, another voice from the populace. Here's an excerpt of what Gene Callahan, contributor to the Crash Landing blog, recently had to say:

Besides the council members who want to keep their jobs, the change is strongly supported by "union leaders and party bosses," who want to establish longer term relationships with council members. Hey, it's a real drag having to re-bribe new councilors every few years!

To read the posting in its entirety, click here!

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Brewin' Up Term Limits Fall

2005-12-13T11:17:00.000-05:00

La Prima Sponsor

Here's how Councilwoman Gale Brewer, prime sponsor of the term limits leg, explained her position on term limits in her Citizens Union candidate questionnaire:

I support three consecutive four year terms. People will be better served if there is more expertise in the Council, and that comes with a longer term. In addition, the quick change of Council Members means that smaller nonprofits who take a couple of years to become acquainted with their local legislator will have to invest more scarce staff time into more lobbying with a new elected official on a regular basis. One result of eight year turn over will be an increase in lobbying expenditures by nonprofits.

Honestly, we don't get it! What's so hard about having a non-profit pick-up the phone to call their local Council Member? The only thing we can think of is that the Council Member may not be as quick to respond to just any non-profit. What else are we missing?

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A Lawyer, Barber & Coed Walk Into a Bar

2005-12-12T11:45:00.000-05:00

Can You Guess What Happens Next?

Duuuhhhh! They form a group called People to Stop a Self Serving Council.

Julia Levy reports on this story in today's New York Sun.

Kenneth Moltner, group co-founder and former head of Community Board 8 doesn't hold back:

"There seems to be in the council an arrogance, just simply an arrogance about it," a founder of the group, Kenneth Moltner, said. "They're shunting democracy for their own self-interest."

And Frank Scala, co-founder #2, had this to say:

"I believe in the word of voters. You have to respect the voters," Frank Scala, who owns La Scala Hair Stylists for Men on Fifth Avenue, said. "I speak with my customers, and they agree with me. Even the customers say, 'I voted for the term limits, so why they want to take it out?'"

While Joe Metzger, political science and history major at NYU - and co-founder #3 - said this:

"If you're going to have term limits, they should be real term limits," Mr. Metzger, who is a Republican District leader in the 75th Assembly District, said.

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Do You Know Something...

2005-12-12T00:12:00.000-05:00

...That We Do Not?

We're quite certain that you, lovely readers, have information that we do not. And so we'd like to ask for your help!

On behalf of your inquiring minds, PO Boss attempted to reach out via email to just about every single current Council Member. But so far all we've gotten back is a big fat goose egg ... nada, zip, zilch, zero by way of response.

The question we asked was simple:

Will you support or oppose Council efforts to alter term limits legislatively (as opposed to voter referendum, Charter Revision Commission, or otherwise)?

So what we've done is put together a handy reference guide which we'll continuously update (click on the image to enlarge).

As you can see it is partially filled according to research we conducted of positions our Council Members have taken on the record, either through the press or through candidate questionnaires. Admittedly, a few of the positions we marked represent our best guestimations.

So far, the NO crew (as in, we will not undo the will of the people) leads the YES crew 17-9. That leaves us with 25 blanks.

So we invite Council Members (or their staffs) - as well as Council Members-elect - to let us know where you stand, and certainly if we've somehow misstated your position.

But we'd also like to ask that if you - readers - have any relevant information you can share with us as to where a certain Member stands on this issue, that you please do so. We could seriously use your investigative instincts.

Email us your findings at publicsway@yahoo.com

Note: chart last updated at 4:30pm, Monday, December 12th

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Bloomberg Pushed to Term Limits

2005-12-10T10:01:00.000-05:00

Insists Council Stop Bellyaching

David Seifman of the New York Post and Dan Janison of Newsday report today on Mayor Mikey's appearance on his weekly radio show with WABC host John Gambling.

During the show yesterday, Mike was asked about the Council's desire to undo the voters' twice-willed term limitations, and here's what he had to say:

This is an outrage.

Whether you like term limits or not, whether you think they're good or not... I happen to think that there's no organization I know that would put somebody in charge for a long period of time. You always want turnover and change. Eight years is great. You learn for four years and do for four years.

But to say that you have to stay beyond that...

One of the arguments they make - I love this - is that you have to keep us because otherwise we have to go run for another office that we're not qualified for. As my kids would say ... HUH?

But the public's voted twice, and the public would vote a third time.

It is an outrage if they do this. It is an outrage to just say to the public we don't care what you think.

I hope that common sense comes to them, and that they don't do this. It would be such an outrage.

But if they do it, you can rest assured that there will be a ballot initiative. ...and how they can hold their heads up after that I don't know.

Click here to listen to the entire broadcast.

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Money Man Billy T

2005-12-09T19:59:00.000-05:00

On the Record

Tonight, Comptroller turn 2009 Mayoral candidate, Billy Thompson, appeared on NY1's Road to City Hall with anchor Davidson Goldin. Asked about the Council's quest to undo their own term limitations, Thompson answered that while he supports extending the Council's term limits to 12 years (3 4-year terms), he thinks "the Council should take it to the voters this time."

Phewww!!!

Thompson even offered to campaign his heart out, night and day, on behalf of such a ballot measure.

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'Nutha Blogga in Da House

2005-12-09T09:57:00.000-05:00

Dan J. Berger, Blogga X-trodinaire

Continuing our Vox Populi series, here's what Dan J. Berger, a "20+ Israeli-American who lives in NYC and works for a popular elected official" has to say about matters of terms:

This is beyond ridiculous. I say this not because I agree with term limits, but because I believe in democracy. Voters have twice voted for term limits and removing them now or changing the law in any way would be a slap in the face to the people of this city. If the City Council is so set on expanding term limits, they should put it before the people once again.

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Mom and Pop Speak Out

2005-12-08T13:20:00.000-05:00

An Indecipherable Lipsky Leaning

Can't say we know exactly which way the bodega-meister, Richard Lipsky, will lean in the term limits battle, but nonetheless thought we'd share the views expressed on his blog this past summer.

A lengthened council term where, undoubtedly a speaker would be in power for a longer period of time, would allow the body to provide a better check on mayoral power. It would, at the same time, rein in some of the St. Vitas Dance that many members now exude in their incessant nervous pursuit of other political opportunities. It would give council members enough time to become serious lawmakers and build a political resume.

Click here to read the entry in its entirety.

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Vox Populi

2005-12-07T21:22:00.000-05:00

Featuring Blogger KipEsquire (A Stitch in Haste)

On the Council's term delimiting plans:

Here we have politicians, who knew the rules before they ran for office, now deciding that they simply don't like the rules, and now intend to change them — the law and the voters be damned. In other words, they're not rules at all, but mere suggestions.

This is no way to run a city.

There's a reason why some of us have more confidence in unelected judges than we do in elected politicians (or the mob rule of direct democracy). It's because we read the newspapers.

As I've said before: Too many houses, not enough pox.

Click here to read the entire posting.

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History Repeats Itself

2005-12-07T16:00:00.000-05:00

Stanley Michels, Case in Point

In 2001, The New York Times ran an editorial in support of a referendum on term limits. At the time, Council Member Stanley Michels (and failed 2005 Manhattan BP candidate), was pushing with everything he had to alter his own term limitations.

In part, here's what the Times had to say:

Some Council members have argued that voters have no appreciation for the disruption caused by the term-limits law. While some inefficiencies will be inevitable with such a large turnover in the Council and all citywide offices next year, nobody is staging a coup. There will still be 16 experienced Council members. Moreover, the newcomers will have help. City Hall has many competent staff members, and the School of Public Affairs at Baruch College is among those promising to help new members during the transition. The school will offer seminars, retreats, a guidebook on the workings of the Council and tips on how to run an office.

Councilman Stanley Michels, a leader of the group opposing term limits, has said that his mission is to save the city from this stampede of newcomers. He misses the main point -- that whatever the voters have taken away, only the voters should have the authority to give back. It is true that elections, not term limits, are the best way to oust mediocre officials. But the right way to end term limits is to call another referendum. Mr. Michels's coalition, Council Speaker Peter Vallone and Mr. Giuliani should agree to do just that.

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Professor John Mollenkopf

2005-12-07T10:11:00.000-05:00

On the 1993 Term Limits Referendum

We asked primo demographer and CUNY Professor, John Mollenkopf, to weigh in on what the base of support for the term limits referendum looked like in 1993.

Here's what he had to say:

In 1993, 1.8 million votes were cast in the mayoral election, but only 728,000 votes were cast on the term limits item. This type of fall off often happens with down-ballot matters.

It [the map showing support for the initiative in 1993] does not seem to show any really consistent racial and ethnic patterns, except that Orthodox Jewish and white Catholic areas were generally least supportive, with results in black areas being mixed, and white liberal and Latino areas generally favorable.

Click on the image (provided to us by Professor Mollenkopf) to enlarge, and see for yourself!

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Waxing Poetic

2005-12-06T12:05:00.000-05:00

On The Record

- New York Times, February 6, 2001

The introduction of a bill in the City Council to rescind the city's term limits law for members of the Council has created a firestorm of reaction from a wide spectrum within New York City's political landscape, with many officials and politicians outside of the Council denouncing the legislation.

---

"They are trying to silence the democratic voice of the people," said Charles Barron, a leadership training consultant who is running for the Council from a district in East New York, Brooklyn.

"When you use a legislative initiative to overturn the will of the people that was expressed in an election, you are attacking democracy. Here is Florida visiting New York. Our votes, once again, don't count."

Mr. Barron has organized a group of a dozen other City Council candidates, along with civic groups and religious organizations, to attend public hearings on the bill and to stage various protests, he said.

---

"My view is that, this last ditch attempt to overturn term limits demonstrates why term limits were necessary in the first place," said Eric Gioia, a lawyer who is running for the Council seat in Queens currently held by Walter L. McCaffrey, one of the bill's sponsors.

"The people have spoken twice on this and it is the height of arrogance to try to overturn the will of the people," Mr. Gioia said. "Government should not be the last refuge for those who can't find work in the private sector."

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The Next 100 Years

2005-12-06T11:46:00.000-05:00

A Binding Referendum?

How could you not get a kick out of this? From The New York Times:

To the Editor:

You suggest that "the right way to end term limits" in New York City is to call yet another referendum (editorial, Feb. 10).

As long as there are incumbents determined to maintain their public positions and others who covet these positions, there will be those who advocate term limits and others who oppose them. Whatever the results of any new referendum, there will inevitably be a clarion call in the near future to have the results reversed.

To put this matter to bed, I suggest that it be stipulated that the results of any new referendum be binding for the next 100 years.

In this way, there would be at least a chance that the outcome would be determined by a clash of political principles as opposed to political expedience.

ZACHARY M. BERMAN
Bronx, Feb. 10, 2001

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Laud 'em or Leave 'em

2005-12-06T00:15:00.000-05:00

Bam!

We're guessin' Lauder's not gonna laud 'em nor leave 'em alone.

What makes us say that, you ask? Ummm ... hmmm...

Well, courtesy of The New York Times, we pulled the script from a television commercial that Lauder (aka New Yorkers for Term Limits) ran last time the Council tried to undo the will of the voters.

You be the judge.

"Does your vote count? Not if the City Council erases the votes of a million New Yorkers with its scheme to kill term limits. The papers call it: 'shabby' and 'self-serving' (The New York Times); 'an attempt by shameless pols to keep their spaces at the public trough' (The Daily News); 'fatuous self-promotion' (The New York Post); 'there cannot be a more bogus cause in government today' (Newsday); and 'contempt for voters' (The Wall Street Journal). Call Council Speaker Peter Vallone and demand he protect term limits. Tell him a million New Yorkers can't be wrong."

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He Said, She Said, He Said, He Said

2005-12-05T16:21:00.000-05:00

At Least We Know Where They Stand

Liu, Quinn, Addabbo and Jackson On The Record
New York Sun, June 20, 2005

"Eight years is plenty of time," a council member from Queens, John Liu, said. The Democrat from Flushing said that while he has never been in favor of the concept of term limits, "The voters have already spoken in two referendums."

"We have term limits - they are called elections," another Manhattan council member, Christine Quinn, said. "Some officials stay in government a long time because that is exactly what their constituents want." Ms. Quinn, who is seeking re-election, said she would support both extending and abolishing term limits for council members.

Ms. Quinn, who indicated she was "very comfortable" about extending term limits without a popular vote, does not worry about that criticism.

"I have, since Day 1, always opposed to term limits. This has nothing to do with my term or tenure in government," she said. "I feel very comfortable being judged on my consistent position."

Council Member Joseph Addabbo Jr. of Queens disagreed.

"To change the law now where it benefits me and others, I don't think it would be fair," he said in an interview. "I would love to entertain the idea, but I think ultimately, whether we agree to do it or not, it has to go back to the people in referendum so they can vote."

Another Manhattan council member, Robert Jackson, disagreed about the need to consult the electorate.

"In my opinion, if we can do it ourselves, that's the easiest way to go," he said. "People will probably challenge it, and go through a legal process - that's the way it has been done in the past. The courts will determine it in the end."

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Observer Edit Heads Weigh In

2005-12-05T10:38:00.000-05:00

Much Nicer than We Are!

This week's New York Observer renders its opinion on the Council's pending attempt to undo the will of the voters. While the editorial doesn't exactly bitch-slap, it does give Council Members a strong no-go signal:

The problem with the Council’s approach thus far is that members say they will simply pass legislation changing the term-limits law, rather than submit their proposal to the very voters who approved the legislation.

This is a foolish and self-defeating approach. It looks like the Council is, in fact, trying to foil the will of the voters.

Brewer's Old Tune

2005-12-05T00:20:00.000-05:00

Not Like New Tune

Old Tune: Brewer says she only wants to start a discussion. She says a public referendum should accompany any legislation that would give incumbents more time in office.

- Newsday editorial, June 2005

And New Tune

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NY Post Edit Heads

2005-12-04T10:18:00.000-05:00

Amusingly Unamused!

In today's New York Post, the editorial board simply rips the Council a new one:

You could say term limits are why New York City has today's "clown council" in the first place.

All in all, scrap them.

But that doesn't mean - by any stretch of the imagination - that the council has the right to take it upon itself to override the will of the people.

If councilmembers want to get rid of term limits, or even loosen the chains a little, they can't (if they care to maintain one shred of integrity) do so without putting the question before the voters.

The Firestorm Begins

2005-12-04T02:00:00.000-05:00

Dadey & Muzzio Not Amused

In today's New York Times, Baruch College Professor Doug Muzzio (who moderated the first Speaker's debate) and Citizens Union Executive Director, Dick Dadey, ream the Council - and the candidates for Speaker - for their intentions to alter term limits without first going to the voters.

"It not only is undemocratic, but amazingly brazen for the Council to think that it can extend term limits without going back to the voters," Mr. Dadey said.

"To do it legislatively is a big mistake," Mr. Muzzio said. "It's bad policy to explicitly overturn the judgment of the voters, and it's bad politics because they're going to get hammered, and rightly so."

We couldn't have said it any better ourselves!

DN Recounts Council Term Limits Feud

2005-12-03T16:12:00.000-05:00

Is CM Avella a PO Boss?

Frank Lombardi of the Daily News interviewed Council Member Avella this week after he sent his colleagues a scathing letter in which he accuses many of them of "plotting" to extend their own term limits without first gaining the public's approval.

In the interview, Avella said he sent the letter - and made it public to the media - because "somebody has to wake them up."

He noted that he and many of the current incumbents were first elected in 2001, when the advent of term limits created dozens of vacancies."

Many were elected because of term limits, and now they want to change the law on their own," he fumed. "It's disgraceful."

Term Limits. What?

2005-12-02T12:30:00.000-05:00

Oh. Now We Understand.

While we're at it, here's another blast from the past. This time from Councilwoman Gale Brewer, the prime sponsor of the latest term limits leg.

In a Newsday piece by Ron Howell in August of 2001:

There are those who, despite some doubts, have great hope that term limits and campaign finance reform will lead to major changes in the City Council and the political scene in New York City generally.

"There will be a lot of younger people and more diversity," said Gale Brewer, a liberal activist and former City Council aide, who is considered by many the front-runner in the West Side race for the seat being vacated by Ronnie Eldridge.

"I think there will be a higher priority on affordable housing because we haven't done much on that. And there will be more on education and working with the parents and organizing communities."

Brewer noted the irony that she and others once opposed term limits as a quack idea of right-wingers from California and Kansas.

How Will You Be Voting, Sir?

2005-12-02T11:57:00.000-05:00

Just Curious...

We were just rereading some old stuff, you know - from back in the day, when the Council was fresh and new. One of the then newly elected members, Queens Council Member Eric Gioia, had this to say to Jonathan Hicks of the New York Times, about the benefits of term limits:

"It's a great thing to have people from such different backgrounds," said Eric N. Gioia, just elected to the Council in Woodside, Queens. "You have people with different experiences, some in government and some as ordinary citizens. That gives the Council a breadth and depth that will be important."

You Say Tomato

2005-12-02T00:03:00.000-05:00

We Say Tomato

Let's call the whole thing off?

So Barrett, is at it, again!

In this week's Village Voice, Wayne Barrett gives Council Members the old smackdown for their intentions to twiddle their term limits.

With Mike Bloomberg settled in at City Hall for four more years, all the action is in the east wing, where the council is awash in self-absorbed intrigue.

In a piece appropriately titled Council Orgy (sounds like), Barrett reminds us why the tinkering of term limits will happen ASAP ...

The obvious theory is to do as much damage as possible to their own reputations as far away from the next election as they conceivably can, betting on public amnesia and jettisoning, for the moment, every opinion but their own.

Avella Takes a Stand

2005-12-01T13:25:00.000-05:00

Finally, Some Balls!

According to The Politicker:

Queens Councilman Tony Avella is circulating a letter to colleagues in which he calls extending term limits "a betrayal of the public trust."

"I find the thought of ignoring the wishes of the citizens of this city by plotting to overturn term limits offensive," he writes.

"If the Council succeeds in this attempt and does establish a third term, I will not serve."

We have since obtained copies of the letter. Click on either image to enlarge.

Spkr Vallone Say Extending Term Limits A-Otay!

2005-12-01T11:36:00.000-05:00

Gotham's Brains Report

Wonkster, the Gotham Gazette's wonkish side, reports that former Speaker Peter Vallone said that he not only supports extending term limits, but thinks it would be absolutely appropriate for the Council to do so by way of legislative fiat - despite the two voter referenda to the contrary.

Vallone cites Lauder's big ducket$ as fundamentally unfair, inferring that his excessive use of resource$ numbed New Yorkers into acquiescence not once, but twice.

You make the call!

Sun Set to Term Limits

2005-12-01T09:34:00.000-05:00

By NY1's Goldin Child

In today's New York Sun, NY1's Road to City Hall anchor Davidson Goldin credits Speaker Miller's political genius with empowering the current term limits saga.

The first to blink is the members' chosen leader, known as the speaker. He wants to run for mayor, but his eight-year limit is up before the mayoral election. In a stroke of political genius, he convinces his colleagues to extend his time by two years. It's a fluke, and the public doesn't really notice.

But that subtle change empowers other council members. If they can so easily modify a measure voters enacted, perhaps they could actually overrule the voters and end term limits altogether. At the very least, some of them say, they can add another term. What politician doesn't like the sound of "Four more years"?

He caps his anti-Council-maneuvering piece by digging at Council Members' attempts to "self-deal" their way out of term limits.

In a sense, ending term limits by legislation is like the council voting out a member elected at the ballot box. Even if the council had that right, voters would surely revolt.

Goldin aptly moderated Monday night's Term Limits Forum at the LGBT Center.

What Happens in the Lobby...

2005-11-30T14:16:00.000-05:00

...Stays in the Lobby?

So the story goes with the city's lobbyists?? Whatever.

A term limits debate raging on The Politicker is making us think a bit longer about the oft-used explanation for why term limits must go, at least according to our Speaker candidates. Time and time again, they cite the increasing power of lobbyists as a rationale to end term limits as we know them. Fine.

But doth they all protest too much? Each is pocketing campaign contributions from many of the city's top lobbyists. For example, Suri Kasirer, who seems to be at the center of attention, has contributed to each of our Speaker candidates - as well as to Councilwoman Gale Brewer, the prime sponsor of the term limits leg.

And for kicks, just take a look at all the PACs and lobbyists that are doling ducket$ to each of the Speaker wanna-bes.

Hmmmm ... We're confused!

250 Broadway Productions Presents

2005-11-30T08:30:00.000-05:00

Ta Ta 2 Term Limits

So, we thought we'd start off our first official day of publication with a shout-out to all Council Members and Council Members-elect slated to hold office next year (see prior posting if you have any question whether or not this applies to you - or your representative, for that matter).

Here's what our inquiring minds want to know. And we promise, it's not a trick question.

For the record, do you support having the Council pass through legislative fiat (as opposed to using other mechanisms such as voter referendum, charter revision commission, etc.) a bill that either extends or repeals the current term limits law?

Truth be told, we'd prefer a simple yes or no answer, but if you feel like you must pontificate - all the power to you! We promise a full-on airing of your views. But first, you must reveal them to us at publicsway@yahoo.com.

And as a holiday gift to us all, why don't we just use the 8th of December as a due date. From that point forward, we'll be keeping a running tally of your responses.

Mayor Mikey Still No Likey

2005-11-30T08:08:00.000-05:00

Tho Voter Ref an "Option"

Generally, Mikey thinks eight is enough - as in, leave the issue of term limits alone. But, should they feel the need to tinker, the Mayor says of the Council's leanings, anything short of giving the voters the final say would be completely unacceptable - in today's New York Post and Daily News.

Sometimes You're In...

2005-11-29T19:04:00.000-05:00

And Sometimes You're Out

Such is the story with term limits.

We've updated the chart made famous by Gotham Gazette to include the newly elected Council Members.

Simply click on the image to enlarge. It makes for a very handy reference guide.

That's Debatable

2005-11-28T23:52:00.000-05:00

Ummm ... Nice Try!

There was one other interesting moment during tonight's term limits forum on which we haven't yet reported. It was when Council Member Gale Brewer, the prime sponsor of the soon-to-be-introduced term limits legislation, left open the possibility that the Council could enact said legislation with the understanding that any changes in the law wouldn't apply to them (hence taking away any and all appearances of self-indulgence).

We must admit, she had us there for a moment! Everyone in the room really started to believe that the Council could actually do the right thing. But when pressed, Brewer mealymouthed what appeared to be a pretty solid refusal to commit to taking this very important step.

Que sera sera!

Council Gall-A-Thon

2005-11-27T16:05:00.000-05:00

One Unimpressed Individual

Michael Goodwin of the Daily News shares his views today on what he sees as the latest in Council antics. Here's a snippet:

The people spoke, but the City Council didn't listen. So the people spoke again, but still the Council didn't listen. Is the Council hard of hearing, or breathtakingly arrogant?

When the subject is term limits, "arrogant" is the answer. The attitude is the public be damned.

Hell Hath No Fury

2005-11-27T00:33:00.000-05:00

Like the DN Scorned

Facing a fate worse than death - by which we mean being forced out of their cushy seats of power - some members of the City Council are toying with trying to repeal the law that limits them to two terms in office. They must be stopped.

Even to consider such an effort, as championed by Manhattan Councilwoman Gale Brewer, is a brazen betrayal of the public will. It was voters who decreed by referendum in 1993 that elected officials would be restricted to eight years in office, not 12 years, as Brewer wants.

- Daily News, Editorial, June 16, 2005

Lauder to Council:

2005-11-24T19:33:00.000-05:00

Go Ahead, Make My Day!

In today's New York Times, Joyce Purnick reveals that wealthy Republican Ronald S. Lauder, who first brought term limits to NYC, will almost definitely put forward the time and resources to undo whatever it is the Council may do.

"I'm going to fight it every way," Mr. Lauder, the cosmetics heir, said in a phone interview. "I will put everything behind it. I didn't fight the battle twice to give up."

And Lauder seems to take personally the irony of what's coming down the pipe.

"...I am just disappointed that people who got in through term limits, who thanked me, saying they never would have gotten in otherwise, want to change it so they can stay in."

Mayor Mikey No Likey

2005-11-24T02:25:00.000-05:00

In Case You Had Any Doubts

The Mayor came out swingin' today in the Daily News railing against the oh-so-savvy-seven Speaker candidates' term delimiting intentions.

Mayor Bloomberg denounced some City Council members' calls to extend their term limits through legislation as an anti-democratic "outrage" - noting voters twice approved the eight-year limit law.

"[While] it may be that the City Council has a right to override them, deliberately saying to the public, 'We don't care what you think,' I would use the word disgraceful," Bloomberg said yesterday.

Latest Term Limits Manifestations

2005-11-23T02:53:00.000-05:00

On NY1

Click here to watch Michael Scotto's latest coverage on the Speaker candidates' moves to alter their own term limits.

It's Official!

2005-11-21T20:01:00.000-05:00

CU Says FU to CMs Looking to Extend Council Terms Via Leg

The historic good government group, Citizens Union, today released a statement which stands up for the citizens, and derides Council Members' efforts to tinker with the term limits law.

Dick Dadey, Executive Director of the Union, had this to say:

"Though there may be compelling and very good reasons to consider extending the term of New York City Council members to three four-year terms, it would be deeply distressing for the body to take the undemocratic step of ignoring the wishes of the voters twice expressed. Willfully flouting those past referendum results and failing to seek the views of current voters would violate the principles of good government and the practice of municipal democracy that Citizens Union supports."

Oh No Likey...

2005-11-20T23:39:00.000-05:00

...What They See

Joyce Purnick of The New York Times predicts today that term limits will go the way of Speaker candidate Bill de Blasio's single-source union contributions bill - straight through the Council.

And the edit heads at the Daily News ... ummm ... not so happy with the whipper-snappers lining up for the Speaker's post ... all of whom basically pledged during a recent debate to absolutely tinker with term limits.

An excerpt to whet your appetite:

The arrogance of it! Having benefited personally from the term limits law, they want to benefit personally from its abolition.

Voters should be aware of this planned end-run around the citizenry's declared desire. If the pols want to change the rules, let them put the proposition before the people. Again. Afraid to do that, gentle councilfolk? Please tell us why.

Ne'er Mind What We Say

2005-11-19T02:12:00.000-05:00

The DN Says Term Limits Going Away

Term limits will be a changin' if your next Speaker has it their way. Referendum to the voters or not, doesn't really seem to matter.Frank Lombardi of the Daily News gives the alteration of term limits a 6.5 out of 7 chance (93%) of happenin'.

Know Why We're Pissed Off?

2005-11-17T21:17:00.000-05:00

B/c - Dear Pols - You're Acting Like Donkeys

No matter where you fall on the question of term limits, and we know you fall somewhere, the issue has been put to the voters not once, but twice over the past 12 years. And both times, we ,the voters, chose to enact them.

We gave you the honor of representing us for 8 years - no more, no less.

So suffice it to say that we're less than thrilled with your latest efforts to tinker with (let alone, completely undo) the job limitations we placed upon you, the same job limitations btw which put many of you into office in the first place.

Now we know that some of you believe that you know better than we do, you've been quoted saying as much. Have you really forgotten, though, that it is you who works for us?

Well, just in case, be aware that there is now one PO Boss here to remind you.

And so, allow us to make our bottom line crystal clear: if you wanna make a change to your term limits, YOU must get OUR approval first - no ifs, ands or buts!